"Cannot Miss" changes

Discussions about possible changes and new features that might happen someday.

Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:06 pm

Dragon Soul isn't changing, at the moment. It's definitely a little less useful than before, given breath weapons themselves don't cost SP. But, unless you spend the 4-6 turns in between using them using only 5 SP or less abilities, you'd usually be missing some SP by the time they come back online. You'd also be down some SP if you did anything before the first use, of course.

If I buff Dragon Soul, it will probably be to make it so that it instead reads "All abilities that check SP assume you have 125 SP": that way, you would no longer need Tireless in order to fully power Breath attacks.

Currently, Attenuation/Agility aren't affecting status application rates... but this is something I'm still thinking about and may change even before this build is released.
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Sat Jan 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Yeah, having thought it over, I think I will have Attenuation/Agility on these abilities affect status application rates. If Agility is going to be taken seriously as a defensive stat, it probably needs to help against both damage and status effects, as Vitality does.
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:53 am

Attenuation will now apply to status effects. Not that you're likely to notice where Chill is concerned. :P

It's worth a reminder that this mechanic exists ability by ability: only abilities that specifically say they are attenuated will use the system.

Finally, I'm considering strengthening the effect Agility has on the mechanic, but not sure how or by how much yet, but I haven't been happy with the performance so far in testing, so some sort of increase is probably coming. However, it will remain true that: 1) You aren't going to be penalized for low Agility, 2) Average Agility won't do much, if anything, you'll need at least some kind of > 0 bonus., 3) You lose the effect of Agility if your evasion is disabled by a debuff of some kind.
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Gaswafers » Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:01 am

Will evasion and dodge effects also affect it?
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:22 am

For now, I'm sticking with Agility only, since that was the thing specifically in need of buffing. I may expand it to include EVD up/down and other defenses like Dodge if I feel they or area effects still need some adjustment (which was another goal of this, though secondary to the Agility buffing: area effects were a bit too dominating.)
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby wizzzargh » Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:27 pm

I didn't see Sudden Chill on the list, but I think it could use a slight beating with the nerf bat so it's not so much better than Mind Scream. Sure Mind is a rare resist, but so is Ice... and Mind doesn't have all those Ice-based goodies going for it.
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Mon Jan 16, 2017 12:18 am

You found two bugs for the price of one :P

It wasn't on the list because I didn't flag it properly in game data (so it didn't come up on my sweep of Cannot Miss abilities)...

...and yes, it definitely needs to be included. It will increase to 55 Power (from 40), but now be subject to attenuation.

Thanks for the catch :D
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Mon Jan 16, 2017 1:59 am

Alright, figured out what I want to do with Agility bonuses... and, for that matter, with evasion buffs/debuffs.

1) I've become a bit uncomfortable with separating attenuation defense and evasion as two different things... so I'm not anymore. :P Evasion will simply be defined as also contributing to defense against attenuated attacks. To that end, anything that affects evasion now affects attenuation defense. This includes: Evasion Up, Evasion Down, Chill, Paralyze, Stun, Shock, etc. Evasion still cannot make attenuation worse, but effects that normally 0 out evasion will certainly prevent it from helping.

2) Evasion's effect on attenuation damage/status effects is now to apply defense = to the % over 100, in proportion to how much attenuation you were already benefiting from. For example:

Code: Select all
Distance from AE Origin | Attenuation% | Evasion Usage%
0                         100%           0%
1                         50%            100%

Distance from AE Origin | Attenuation% | Evasion Usage%
0                         100%           0%
1                         75%            50%
2                         50%            100%

Distance from AE Origin | Attenuation% | Evasion Usage%
0                         100%           0%
1                         83%            34%
2                         67%            67%
3                         50%            100%


So basically, at the outermost fringe of an AE, you get the full benefit of your evasion, as defense. At the origin... still nothing, just like before.

A few examples of how this plays out in practice:

Code: Select all

                                                          Total Effect At:
Dist/Max from AE Origin | Attenuation% | Evasion Usage% | 100 Evd  125 Evd  150 Evd  175 Evd  200 Evd
0/N                       100%           0%               100%     100%     100%     100%     100%
N/N                       50%            100%             50%      40%      33%      28%      25%
1/2                       75%            50%              75%      66%      60%      54%      50%
1/3                       83%            34%              83%      77%      71%      66%      62%
2/3                       67%            67%              67%      58%      50%      45%      40%

N = N can be any integer, but if used twice on the same line, it must be the same both times.


Evasion here is being used in exactly the same way Defense usually is: Value * 100 / Evd. i.e. An Evd of 200 causes the Value to be halved, as you can see in the N/N example.

If the differences seem small.. I should point out that Strength's benefit to Defense (which, other than a Defense Up buff, is currently the only way to get a Defense above 100) being allowed to run to 100-200 was ridiculously overpowered. I'm actually allowing Agility's to run to 100-200 still because it: 1) Only applies to attenuated attacks, 2) And only applies fully when at the edge of an attack. But, to put it in another perspective: the bonus you get at Evasion Usage of 50% basically means your Agility is acting just like Strength for the purpose of reducing that attack's damage... and yes, Evasion Usage of 100% means it's twice as good as Strength is now (or as good as Strength was back when it was OP.) All this and it also applies to any status effects being applied by the attack too. :D

Finally, I think I am going to have to put a small SP cost back on breath weapons. :P At 0 SP, it's far too likely they'd end up "every character uses one, even if not skilled at Magic/Cunning". Probably only 15-20 though.. not the 35+ they used to live at.

Thanks to everyone, with an extra cookie for gaswafers, for taking part in this discussion here. :) It's much easier to get these things right the first time when people help me poke at it ahead of time, and I appreciate the help. :D
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Gaswafers » Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:50 am

How does Lucky Dodge interact with attenuation?
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Re: "Cannot Miss" changes

Postby Ferret » Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:16 am

At the moment, not at all. I only added in evasion buffs/debuffs. I could see allowing Block and Dodge (not Parry though, doesn't seem to fit) to have an effect too.

If I did anything, I'd probably have Block and Dodge chances checked to try and push your effective distance from center out by 1... possibly exceeding the usual limits. In such a case, Lucky Dodge would act normally: it would add 20% to the chance, and if successful, there would be a 20/TotalDodgeChance chance of Lucky Dodge going on cooldown.
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